The idea is completely countercultural in this type of association. But its president, Arthur Dénouveaux, has no doubts. “We don’t want to be professional victims. And that’s why we have to disband.” Ten years after the November 13 attacks in the French capital, the president of Life for Paris, one of the two associations that embraced and helped the victims, has decided that his journey is over. We must close the wound, look forward, stop being victims. On Tuesday afternoon, Dénouveaux, a survivor of the Bataclan attack, meets EL PAÍS in a café near the Paris city hall, where next Thursday the tenth anniversary of the attacks will be celebrated with a ceremony created by Thierry Reboul, the same creator of the famous ceremony of the Olympic Games.
Ask. Ten years later, is France a better country?
Answer. No. We experienced covid, the war in Ukraine… but the only thing that united us was the ceremony of the Olympic Games. That’s why we asked him (Thierry Reboul) to do something similar with the events of 13-N. There will be music, dancing, speeches, we will think about the dead, the living…, but also about French culture. And we will remember that they did not kill all this.
Q. Has France been more polarized since then?
R. Yes, in everything: from religion, to politics, to the question of secularism. It’s very difficult for us not to be against something. But we have a different approach: in the association there are people from the right, from the left…, we have experienced something too important to be able to face it. We talk to each other. And France lost it.
Q. Was there political exploitation of the victims?
R. They tried, but we stopped them. Like when Éric Zemmour went to the Bataclan during the presidential campaign, on November 13, 2021. I called him a defiler on Twitter and this dissuaded others. The problem is that by trying to avoid exploitation, we have also prevented debate. It wasn’t said calmly. And this is also our responsibility.
Q. Many associations of victims of terrorism end up being very politicised. Were you afraid this would happen?
R. We are apolitical. And for the same reason we will dissolve. First of all because we achieved our goals. And, above all, because we don’t want to continue to be victims. How could we do this if we are still in a partnership? We have fought many battles, but if we do not want to be professional victims we must stop. The final goal was to have a place of remembrance in Paris, and we achieved it. We have made a difficult decision, we are in a good moment of influence. But if we continue, it will become political. The best bands are the ones who know how to stop!
Q. You have a demanding job. How did you put it together.
R. It is important, in fact, not to be a professional victim. If I had the whole week off, maybe I’d do something stupid. So I only do useful things.
Q. Can we achieve something like forgiveness to live in peace?
R. I have no problem with forgiveness, but I don’t need to forgive because I don’t have a relationship with them. They live in a world that isn’t mine. I went to the trial not out of thirst for revenge, but for justice.
Q. Why do you think there are young people who still want to kill the French, as you say?
R. France separated the State from the Church with the law of 1905. At that time the State was strong, powerful. He could tell a child that if he was good at school he could become President of the Republic, no matter where he came from. But today we have no religion and the state is null, it could be a company run by a CEO. The jihadists arrive with a speech in which they propose a destination to the young people convinced that France will not offer it to them. And it’s terribly cynical.
Q. Can it be prevented in schools?
R. Let’s try. But we don’t reach all students and we haven’t been able to reach an agreement with national education to make it more widespread. The idea of Thursday’s ceremony is that the images can be used in schools.
Q. Is secularism applied correctly?
R. Secularism should allow everyone to practice their religion without disturbing others. But the far right has perverted this by saying that it is Muslims who prevent this. We asked that the attacks not be used to claim secularism. But politicians are only interested in the economy and re-election.
Q. Do you think the Bataclan should have closed?
R. It’s an important topic that we haven’t discussed. It’s a private place with owners who had to pay the bills. Symbolically it is good to reopen to send a signal to terrorists. Could a museum have been created? Why not. But I’m happy that it’s still a concert hall. What I never wanted was for it to disappear.
Q. Are you back?
R. At first I went to see him. And then I went back to other concerts. But never in the same place, I fear I’m having a post-traumatic stress crisis.
Q. Have you ever felt guilty for surviving?
R. I don’t feel guilty because I couldn’t do anything. But I feel responsible to do more things: live stronger, work starting from the association…
Q. What do you normally do on November 13th?
R. I always isolate myself for an hour so I can think. And then, the truth is that we go drinking a lot together. Other years we rented a river boat with open bar. And honestly, we laughed. And you know, we also do dark humor. November 13th is the saddest and also the happiest day we have.
